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Maedhros' club; a place for the raving Russandol fans
http://arwen-undomiel.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=20056		 Page 4 of 4
Author:  DARKastheRAIN [ February 16th, 2010, 8:48 am ]
Post subject: 
I just found an interesting description of Maedhros's hair (or really his grandfather's hair with reference to his hair being the same) that's a little different from the commonly quoted red-brown.

"His hair was not as dark or black as was that of most of the Noldor, but brown, and had glints of coppery-red in it. Of Nerdanel's seven children the oldest, and the twins (a very rare thing among the Eldar) had hair of this kind. The eldest also wore a copper circlet."
-from the notes on the Shibboleth of Fëanor, HoME v. 12

Strange. I've never heard this particular despription before. Is brown with glints of coppery-red the same as straight up red hair?

This is also the first time I've finally seen actual evidence that the claim of Maedhros wearing a copper circlet really is canon and not just and invention of wikipedia.

On a side note, when Tolkien says "a very rare thing among the Eldar" he is talking about the hair and not the twins, right? Because there seem to be a lot of pairs of Elf-boys running around that I've always tentatively taken to be twins.
Author:  Nerissa [ April 12th, 2010, 4:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
No, no... Get the mental images out of my head... Maedhros the squirrel was not what I needed to see... :lol:
Sure, he looks innocent, just sitting there and looking cute. But when he's got a sword in his little squirrel paws...

Still, I can't decide if that's worse than the LOLFeanorians or not. Hmm.

Edit: By the way, he doesn't look that much different than an American (red) squirrel. And, since there are different colors of squirrels, one could probably write up a whole Squirrelmarillion. In pictures. *cough*
Author:  Nerissa [ April 13th, 2010, 10:41 am ]
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Aaaah! :hide: The nightmares that are to come now...
Still, SquirrelMorgoth is rather evilly adorable.

That thump you just heard may or may not have been Tolkien rolling over in his grave.
Author:  Nerissa [ April 13th, 2010, 2:09 pm ]
Post subject: 
Oooohoo, thanks for clearing that up for me. Floating, burning, all-seeing hazelnuts would certainly make sense... I mean, he has to have some extra security somehow, right? Besides that, the knowledge he could acquire about anything and everything would be quite enormous.

Aerlinn wrote:
This club + seriousness & on-topic. = fail. Not that we've had a consistent topic since page one...tis pure chaotic evul. >=D

Chaotic, yes. Eviiiiiil, yesss. Me having anything to do with that? Nooo, of course not... :whistle: It just follows me, that's all.
Author:  Gersemi [ April 24th, 2010, 7:30 pm ]
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Fëanorian squirrels? How disturbing lol
Author:  Nerissa [ May 3rd, 2010, 12:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
^Don't think of it as disturbing, think of it as something... eccentric. With time, you'll grow accustomed to it...

Alas, Aerlinn, I haven't read a good fanfic in aaages. Aah, my depressing, busy life. :teehee:

Feanor the all-knowing squirrel! All shall fear him and despair! Still, I think I'll stick with pledging my allegiance to cute little Maedhros-squirrel, who narrowly seems less intimidating. :P
Author:  Gersemi [ May 7th, 2010, 4:12 pm ]
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Nerissa wrote:
^Don't think of it as disturbing, think of it as something... eccentric. With time, you'll grow accustomed to it...


:lol:
But I much prefer them as Elves :P
Author:  Gersemi [ May 8th, 2010, 6:07 pm ]
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Lol, true enough. They are less dangerous as squirrels, but the Fëanorians are of a fiery and dangerous nature, that's who they are. That's what makes them hot XD
Author:  DARKastheRAIN [ July 28th, 2010, 4:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
Aerlinn wrote:
It's a rather pretty, warm colour :D Like a (european. Aren't american ones different looking? ) squirrel! Awwww :P


I think American ones are generally grey. Yours are a lot prettier. You Europeans get the best of everything.


I think Tolkien was more inclined to compare his hair to a fox though. At least his grandfather's nickname, 'Rusco', means fox.

I had to find a really pretty picture of a fox for Maedhros, because not just anything would do. He is Maitimo after all.

How's this?
Image

The fur's lighter than I imagine Maedhros's hair though. (but then again my monitor is very bright. It makes everything look a lot lighter than it did on my old computer. How does it look to you?)

And let's not forget Ambarussa :D

Image


Of course, the problem with foxes is you can't escape the modern associations. I certainly don't think of Maedhros as "foxy".

But I fear I may be alone in not seeing this as an added bonus. :D
Author:  Eowyn_Shieldmaiden [ October 31st, 2010, 10:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
Don't worry Aerlinn, as long as I'm around, there's another Maedhros fan on A-U and, I suspect, there are more who just don't know it yet!
Author:  Evil.Shieldmaiden [ October 18th, 2015, 5:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Maedhros' club; a place for the raving Russandol fans
Wow! I can't believe I posted that entry under my alter ego almost five years ago! I still a Maedhros fan, even though I seem to be the only one on the site.
Author:  Elthir [ October 20th, 2015, 8:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re:
I realize this person last visited about five years ago (under this name anyway), but...

DARKastheRAIN wrote:
I just found an interesting description of Maedhros's hair (or really his grandfather's hair with reference to his hair being the same) that's a little different from the commonly quoted red-brown.

"His hair was not as dark or black as was that of most of the Noldor, but brown, and had glints of coppery-red in it. Of Nerdanel's seven children the oldest, and the twins (a very rare thing among the Eldar) had hair of this kind. The eldest also wore a copper circlet."
-from the notes on the Shibboleth of Fëanor, HoME v. 12

Strange. I've never heard this particular despription before. Is brown with glints of coppery-red the same as straight up red hair?


I guess it might depend upon what you mean by straight up red hair. Maedros' hair is described, as you noted, as brown with glints of coppery red, and in another section of The Shibboleth of Feanor, he is said to have inherited the rare "red-brown" hair of Nerdanel's kin. So Tolkien doesn't simply employ "red" here, and of course Russandol means "copper top".

That said, still in The Shibboleth of Feanor, Maedros is also described as having reddish hair like the twins -- and they are at least once described as "red-haired". But then again, as they are included in your quote (nore 61 to The Shibboleth of Feanor) they too would seem to have brown hair with glints of coppery red. It was also said that the elder of the twins "grew drarker in hair".

There's also a note (associated with this) published in Vinyar Tengwar:

Quote:
"Common Eldarin (u)rus [was] used of a varying brownish red from what we should call brick-red to auburn. Hence Quenya, Telerin urus (stem urust-), Sindarin rust "copper", rustui adj; Quenya [deleted: ruska "red-brown"] rusko "a fox" (rusku-, pl. rusqui; ruskuite "foxy"). (calarus(t)- polished copper, lairus(t) verdigris.) russe a head or pelt of red hair, russa "red haired. S. rusc fox, ross (russā) red-haired, copper coloured, especially used of animals, as fox, red deer, and [?similar kind.]"

JRRT, note on Russandol, From The Shibboleth of Feanor, Vinyar Tengwar 41


If that helps ;-)

Quote:
On a side note, when Tolkien says "a very rare thing among the Eldar" he is talking about the hair and not the twins, right? Because there seem to be a lot of pairs of Elf-boys running around that I've always tentatively taken to be twins.


I would normally interpret the statement there to refer to the twins, as Tolkien placed it after "twins" and not after "had hair of this kind", but that said, Tolkien had also noted that Maedros had the "rare" red-brown hair of Nerdanel's kin.

So... hmm :-D
Author:  Evil.Shieldmaiden [ October 20th, 2015, 6:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Maedhros' club; a place for the raving Russandol fans
Interesting information. Thanks.

Personally, based on the fact that the Noldor, and most Elves for that matter were dark haired, I've always envisioned Maedhros and the Ambarussa as having auburn hair which would fit in with the descriptions. I've never seen them as having the coppery hair you find in most artists' interpretations.
Author:  Elthir [ October 21st, 2015, 3:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Maedhros' club; a place for the raving Russandol fans
A possibly interesting further question: are we imagining the "final" version of Maedros as Tolkien did?

I would say so, generally speaking, but I believe there is some mist surrounding whether or not Maedros (not Maedhros) was the very latest form of this character's name...

... in any case we know Tolkien wrote a late note stating that he would change Maedros to Maedron, which appears to remove the russa/ros element, which is the element that refers to this hair colour. See below the line for the possible obscurity here however.

Of course even if so, Maedron could remain red-brown haired. He could even retain the Quenya name Russandol and still be called Maedron in Sindarin (Tolkien would just have to explain that russa was not involved in the Sindarization), although at least one person I've chatted with on the web thinks Tolkien wanted to get rid of this russa/ros altogether, given Tolkien's failed solution to make the "other ros word", the other one that meant "foam, spray", a Beorian word.

Still, to my mind it seems a lot to give up, all based on a note which may or may not reveal the "latest known" form of the name, and even if latest, may or may not mean Russandol's hair had changed, or had to change.

Plus I just like the whole coppery idea :)

_____________

A) in The Shibboleth of Feanor and notes on the names of Feanor's sons: Maedros, Maglor. This text dates to 1968 or later

B) The Maedron note (given in notes to The Problem Of Ros): Maedron is arguably later than the Shibboleth at least, but...

C) ... then we have Tolkien's note in a copy (his own copy) of The Return of the King, which includes Maedros and Maelor

The note with Maedros and Maelor in Tolkien's Return of the King includes a reference to Umbarto being burned, and if it's the case, as CJRT thinks, that this idea (of Umbarto dying) arose in the course of Tolkien's notes on the names of the sons of Feanor (given at the end of The Shibboleth of Feanor), I think this arguably opens up the possibility, at least, that the 'Maedros Maelor note' in RK might follow even the Maedron note.

Erm, I think :-D
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