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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: July 20th, 2013, 3:51 pm 
Vala
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However, they don't necessarily have to do that either. Remember that InGen created these animals. If you'd read the books, they explain it way more closely there. But the point is they haven't really brought back to life something that's been dead, they've just recreated it. And as such, they were free to make changes wherever they pleased. In the book, Hammond insists that they're dealing with real dinosaurs, but the scientists behind it underline that they're not really. It's more like a recreation based on what they think they know.

Besides, the first movie was made in 93 and since then there has been a lot of discoveries when it comes to dinosaurs. I think it's completely fair enough that they choose to continue with the style of dinosaurs they've already created rather than suddenly changing pretty much everything just to stick with what we do know. And again, InGen hasn't brought anything back to life, and real life scientist have no actual idea how dinosaurs lived, thought, etc.

I think if we want to start picking apart the plot on the fourth movie based on the fact that they used the term "dinosaurs" to describe large reptiles that live only in water we have to throw everything else in the movies away too.

- The T-Rex couldn't run as fast as they say, and they have no idea at all if its sight was based on movement. Although most likely it wasn't at all, that's just something the author of the book made up.

- Velociraptors were about the size of turkeys, were covered in feathers, and looked nothing like the raptors in the movies (or books, for that matter).

- All (or at least near) dinosaurs were most likely covered in feathers, more or less.


Besides, if we're going to go that far with this whole "it has to be accurate" attitude, then the entire premise of the books and movies are ridiculous beyond imagination since we do not in fact even remotely have the technology or knowledge to create dinosaurs again.

So to conclude:

1. If we speak as if the movies/books are real, InGen didn't bring anything back to life, they created their own version of the dinosaurs as they a) believed they were and b) they wanted them to be. In the first book, Henry Wu (seen briefly in the film) explains that their dinosaurs in the park when the disaster strikes aren't even the first version of the animals, since each time they made an animal they realized things they could improve on and then they simply made another, slightly altered, version. He is also insisting to Hammond that they bring around version 4.0, which will have the animals calmer and more docile. So, keeping this in mind, it makes perfect sense that the dinosaurs wouldn't really reflect all that we know today. In the third movie, Alan Grant also says; "What John Hammond and InGen did at Jurassic Park is create genetically engineered theme park monsters." In the first movie Ellie points out that they've got plants growing that are poisonous, but were chosen simply because they look good. This strongly implies that many dinosaurs were altered, because they look good.

2. In 1993 when the first movie was made we didn't know as much about dinosaurs as we do now. Back then they used the knowledge they had and tweaked it to make a better story. This includes the books. Seriously, they weren't exactly making a documentary. Otherwise we should probably also bring up how every other single movie in the history of the world doesn't reasonably reflect the reality we live in. Regardless of the genre, we're incredibly unlikely to receive the "real deal". And it's also like with Jaws, for example. In that movie they state clearly that the great white shark had gotten a taste for human flesh and thus it would continue eating people. This is something we've learned since isn't true, since sharks behave nothing like they did in that movie and don't at all love the taste of people. However, it was what they knew then and it made for a better movie. Jaws didn't either set out to portray sharks with 100% accuracy - it was a horror film, not a documentary about sharks.

3. If the dinosaurs looked as credible as possible and acted as credibly as possible the movies would probably be pretty boring. Everyone would probably survive, unless they accidentally got trampled by something. Dinosaurs weren't the kind of monsters they act like in Jurassic Park, at least not by what some scientists claim. But again, we can't all know for sure either way. And at the end of the day, InGen (within the story) and Spielberg (outside of it) wanted to create dinosaurs that would look, feel and act spectacular. And they created them with what knowledge they had.


And for the record, even to this day some paleontologists claim one thing and others another. So there's no definite way to prove much about the dinosaurs at all.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: July 22nd, 2013, 2:27 pm 
Gondorian
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I've read the books, but a few years ago and I don't remember very well everything they said there anymore.
You know, I am aware that times have changed since Crichton's books publication and the movies premieres, but I've never said I have something against the already made movies. On the contrary, I really like them, believe me. It is an adaptation of the Crichton's book, not a scientific book and that's obvious. Then again, the director had a palaeontologist to help with creating dinosaurs. And overall, they succeeded.

Bellatrix wrote:
I think if we want to start picking apart the plot on the fourth movie based on the fact that they used the term "dinosaurs" to describe large reptiles that live only in water we have to throw everything else in the movies away too.

It's a known fact that dinosaurs lived only on land, not underwater. You surely can find out about it from every book on it.
Quote:
- The T-Rex couldn't run as fast as they say, and they have no idea at all if its sight was based on movement. Although most likely it wasn't at all, that's just something the author of the book made up.

Please, this is nothing that dramatically changes everything. Even if, remember they added DNA of other species, including frog's, to dinosaurs' DNA, and frogs' vision is sensitive to movement, it blended in a way so this might be a reason?
Quote:
- Velociraptors were about the size of turkeys, were covered in feathers, and looked nothing like the raptors in the movies (or books, for that matter).

Not sure, but I've heard velociraptor was due to be Deinonychus but since it was Velociraptor that appeared in the book they decided not to change it in the movie
Quote:
- All (or at least near) dinosaurs were most likely covered in feathers, more or less.

No, mostly only carnivorous (or even omnivorous) dinosaurs, mainly theropods, had or could had feathers. Herbivores hadn't, or veeery few had.

Still not sure if you understood me, but the only thing I'm complaining on is the 4th movie (possible) plot, and only this. Particularly tamed dinosaurs. If you think this idea is good, fair enough, but literally no one will persuade me to thinking tamed dinosaurs are something ok and normal. To me, this idea is simply ridiculous. The 1-3 movies showed that we really can make a good films about dinosaurs, showing they were not monsters only just reptiles with their own instinct, without totally altering them into the docile animals.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: July 22nd, 2013, 3:12 pm 
Vala
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Tamed dinosaurs make perfect sense if you've read the first book, where Wu clearly states that he wants to create version 4.0 of the dinosaurs which would have them be way more tame. It seems very logical that they'd sooner or later decide on doing that. Especially after the three disasters they've already had. Or okay, two, the third movie didn't really bring any disasters to anyone off the island. So why wouldn't they? I think it seems far more ridiculous that they'd find investors and support from the general public considering the total disasters that followed the other two attempts of making the park. Unless they changed the way they made the dinosaurs so they were more tame, and calm, and docile. The idea that they'd be able to build another park with the exact same wild animals again after two disasters is ridiculous.

So yes, I did understand you, and the above was my point all along. They had the power - within the movie/book-verse - to alter these animals a lot. Not just when it came to looks and appearances, but also how they acted. Seriously, if they could "control" what genders they were surely they could control how docile they are. Yes, obviously that didn't work out in the end, but initially it did. Same can easily be assumed for a fourth movie. They created new versions of the dinosaurs, more updated versions, and these were more docile and thus they thought they'd succeeded in making tame dinosaurs that wouldn't be of any real danger. And then they find out they failed again, because as Malcolm keeps pointing out, you can't control life like that.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: July 24th, 2013, 9:25 am 
Gondorian
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I can see you point, but when I read the plot for the first time at once a vision of a raptor on a lead sprang to mind, which was really preposterous, so... :| I don't know, maybe I should reread the books and recall things but I don't think it'll change my view on this idea. I'm just not going to swallow everything they want to serve in this movie. Yet, I hope to be positively surprised.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: July 24th, 2013, 9:41 am 
Vala
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In the books, what Biosyn wanted to do was to re-create dinosaurs as pets. So people could get one as if it was a dog. So although the idea sounds ludicrous, it would fit perfectly in with the book/movie-verse.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: July 27th, 2013, 8:42 am 
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Ian Malcolm would have had a lot to say about making pets of dinosaurs... Anyway, not very likely the movie's going to be released next year.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: July 27th, 2013, 8:49 am 
Vala
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He did have a lot to say about dinosaurs being made at all. In the movies it's not as clear, but in the books it is.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: July 27th, 2013, 8:55 am 
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Yeah I know, I liked his "lectures" on chaos theory ;p

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: July 27th, 2013, 9:35 am 
Vala
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I love his character in the movies but I love him more in the books. He's very cynical, I like that. I also love how he was saying the whole time that everything would go wrong.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: September 13th, 2013, 3:19 pm 
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There's a new name for the 4th JP movie, it's "Jurassic World". And also, I found out the movie premiere has been moved to 2015... which was easy to predict I suppose. Aaand, I read somewhere (can't find any English source) there would be no tamed dinos in this movie and overall this previous plot wasn't real and confirmed (that's fine by me).

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: September 18th, 2013, 9:13 pm 
Vala
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It's fine by me too. I did find out the other day though that the new movie is called Jurassic World. I hope it'll be awesome.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: November 22nd, 2014, 1:35 pm 
Vala
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Here is now the official plot for Jurassic World with a release date in 2015:

"Twenty-two years after the events of Jurassic Park, Isla Nublar now features a fully functioning dinosaur theme park, Jurassic World, as originally envisioned by John Hammond."

I'm not really pleased, mainly because I really wanted some cast from the original movies to turn up. But it does have a good cast line-up so hopefully it'll be good enough.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: November 24th, 2014, 11:02 am 
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There will be actually someone from the previous movies: BD Wong. Well, I personally counted on an appearance of particularly Sam Neill or Jeff Goldblum, but fair enough :]

The first trailer airs this Thursday!

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: November 24th, 2014, 4:43 pm 
Vala
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Yeah, those were the two I was hoping for. At least giving them some form of cameo role, just jumping in there for a moment or five.

Can't wait for the trailer.

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: November 24th, 2014, 6:35 pm 
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Yeah the trailer premieres thursday!

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 Post subject: Re: Jurassic Park [Trilogy, plus fourth movie]
PostPosted: November 25th, 2014, 2:50 pm 
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Heh, it was supposed to be on Thursday but it's already here!



:happy:

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