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PostPosted: August 2nd, 2006, 12:59 pm 
Dwarf
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You're forgetting that Melkor is the mightiest dweller in Arda, and he had many many Ainur in his service. It may well be that he had hundreds of Balrogs, yet only seven managed to survive that war.

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PostPosted: August 2nd, 2006, 1:27 pm 
Gondorian
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Tolkien's latest Idear was this:

"There should not be supposed more than say 3 or at most 7 ever existed (Balrogs)"~HoME 10, Morgoth's Ring


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PostPosted: August 2nd, 2006, 2:28 pm 
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Ok but he may still have had lots of Balrogs.

And it's funny how you accept that quote as being his final decision, yet you are willing to continue arguing his final decision on orcs origins

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PostPosted: August 2nd, 2006, 3:48 pm 
Gondorian
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The reason I argue it is becuase there are far more quotes suggesting Orcs are Elves than men.
Believe as you will - I am not dismissing that Orcs are Men - what I am saying is that they were first bred from Elves.


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PostPosted: August 2nd, 2006, 7:32 pm 
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May I ask where that quote is from?

The book is called:: "Tolkien:: The Illustrated Encyclopedia" put together by David Day. I am not at all insisting that this is an entirely reliable source as it is not Tolkien himself but one is not allowed to write a book that is full of falsehoods ... meaning this man has to have been very clear on Middle-earth's history to have written this book. And I still believe that Orcs were first originated from Elves.

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PostPosted: August 3rd, 2006, 9:58 pm 
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ah ?? :confused:
but at the history of middle_earth Ⅵ,orcs=human being..........in silmarils,he said that orcs=elves~
er .......so strange//and the creatures Tolkien liked most are elves......so...... :angel:

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PostPosted: August 4th, 2006, 4:56 am 
Gondorian
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yes that has often bothered me.remember the scene where the elvish maidens of nargathrond are led away in chains,never to be seen again?i cant help but wonder what was done to them.maybe eu could turn them into elves again.but they would have to want to be.they prob have no memory of being descended from elves

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PostPosted: August 4th, 2006, 8:19 am 
Dwarf
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They were all slaughtered by the orcs when the army of Brehtil attempted to free them

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PostPosted: August 4th, 2006, 8:41 am 
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well.....I have read in an article that a female orc can have four udders = =...... :confused: :confused2: :blink:
It seems that Tolkien had changed his mind about Orcs :bones: :bones: :bones: ....first he wrote in Sil that orcs=elves,afterwords, he decided not to connect baeutiful :-D :-D creatures to such ugly,noisome creatures like elves,so.....he has displayed it in HoMe.
and there're definite differences between these two beings/

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PostPosted: October 9th, 2006, 2:52 pm 
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i discovered that the orcs were from elves in the TTT movie, but off-subject, sorry.

i can't believe that! CURSE U MELKOR!

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PostPosted: October 12th, 2006, 11:58 am 
Ent
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Yes. We are also told that Orcs were once elves in The Lord of the Rings The Fellowship of the Ring. It made me sick when i forst heard Sauruman explain to Lurtz

'...They were elves once...Tortured and Mutilated...'

That's sooo cruel! It really sounds menacing. I haven'd read the Simillarion yet but i will soon...gosh that's horrible!

I wonder where Sauron came from. Middle-Earth is far too real to dismiss as a story. In fact, i bet it does exist and Tolkien was once there in a past life...hmmm.....just believe i guess.

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PostPosted: October 12th, 2006, 12:32 pm 
Gondorian
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Sauron is of the same race as Melkor his master, only a lesser order.

Its to big a deal to discuss now but you need to read the Ainulindale in the Silmarillion.


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PostPosted: October 12th, 2006, 5:10 pm 
Elf
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YAY! I JUST STARTED IT! yeah, after melkor died, sauron ran away and later came back with reenforcements. hehehe. right?

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PostPosted: October 12th, 2006, 5:26 pm 
Gondorian
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Which part are you refering to?


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PostPosted: October 12th, 2006, 6:09 pm 
Elf
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the book. i read the first chapter. i can't remember the name though...

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PostPosted: October 13th, 2006, 5:24 am 
Gondorian
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Ahh you mean where Melkor has to flee from Tulkas and then Sauron takes command in his stead?


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