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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: September 25th, 2016, 8:33 pm 
Gondorian
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Aww..... I think that would make such a romantic story!

I think gandalf and galadriel would would look cute together.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: September 26th, 2016, 12:07 pm 
Queen of Eregion
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I dislike the whole idea that a male and female can't be extremely good friends without having a romantic relationship. They were absolutely above that. You gotta remember that they were 2 of the wisest and most powerful beings in Middle-earth, who also shared the powers and burdens of their rings of power. They shared a special but very platonic relationship I think. Relationships for Elves are vastly different than what we know. She was married and committed to Celeborn. Elves were as monogamous as they come and marry for love...marriage was a very sacred bond to them. The idea of Galadriel committing adultery is simply absurd to me. I do believe they had a very deep friendship though. Perhaps there could have been a romantic mutual interest but it wouldn't have escalated beyond that.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: September 26th, 2016, 8:21 pm 
Warden of the Knight
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I would tend to agree with that. They were both far to wise and as mentioned were two of very few who had some things in common like the rings and a world (litterally) of experience.

In can't see them having any kind of inclination towards eachother. Other than all that, though, do wizzards even marry? Has Tolkien touched on the issue? I am not aware of any that did.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: September 26th, 2016, 10:03 pm 
Queen of Eregion
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Well I don't know about the Istari specifically, I don't recall it ever being mentioned by Tolkien, but I don't see why they shouldn't; other Maiar had the freedom to be married and have children. The thing with the Istari though is that they were Maiar who were sent to Middle-earth for a very specific purpose: they were on a mission to help bring about the defeat of Sauron. Considering Gandalf was the only one of the five who saw this through to the end, and was even brought back from death once when he died prematurely, I think that any romantic relationship would have just been pointless, a hindrance, and completely uncharacteristic. Everything he did while in Middle-earth was for a purpose.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: September 27th, 2016, 10:36 pm 
Warden of the Knight
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I see. Well, I suspect if others could he could have as well. I do agree with the point, though, that it seems like a hindrance and out of character for Gandalf. I couldn't say for Galadriel as far as her character. It shows little of that in the movies.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: September 27th, 2016, 11:23 pm 
Queen of Eregion
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He being a devout Catholic, I just can't see Tolkien envisioning any of his characters committing any sort of infidelity, even if it's just in an emotional sense. :happy:

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: September 30th, 2016, 9:59 pm 
Dunedain Ranger of Arnor
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Since The Unexpected Journey was on a free-to-air channel last night, I watched about ⅔'s of it. It was the first time I wayched this since I attended a premiere showing of it before it was released. I will give credit where credit is due, and say that Galadriel was much better portrayed by Cate Blanchett in this movie than in Fellowship. The essence of Galadriel was captured in all ways at the White Council, and the Council scenes were for the most part well done. I didn't like the fact they tuned out Sarumann though, for I don't think that would happen. He wasn't known to be corrupted at the time. Anything else can I say I liked ??? yeah, Martin Freeman as Bilbo did an amazing job! That is all the good I can really say about it.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: October 10th, 2016, 1:09 am 
Warden of the Knight
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Aredhel Ar-Feiniel wrote:
He being a devout Catholic, I just can't see Tolkien envisioning any of his characters committing any sort of infidelity, even if it's just in an emotional sense. :happy:



I would have to agree. However, working on the assumption that Middle earth has taken on a "Life of it's own" and grown outside of Tolkien's original ideals... I still can't see it from the characters themselves.






@Hanasian I must admit. I did like Galadriel's role in the hobbit films better than in the original trilogy.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: January 20th, 2017, 8:20 am 
Dunedain Ranger of Arnor
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Not being a big fan of PJ's fanfic of The White Council, I will give credit for making these scenes the best of the whole Hobbit movie franchise. I think it is a simple minded reach to try and make Gandalf and Galadriel appear romantically involved. but I'll give PJ credit here in not really making it like that, but trying to show a deep understanding between the two. It was ethereal, not physical.

I still think that Cate looked very 'Galadrielish' in these scemes, and they crapped on Saruman in these scenes, but it was already known by movie-only audiences that he would sell out the west in his power play that was shown in the earlier movies. Sadly, Elrond was somewhat marginalized in these scenes as well. It was a classic case of (in my opinion) PJ showing a sign if genius in his portrayal of things Middle Earth, only to snatch it away by some crappy screenplay writing. Oh well.... it is his signature.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: January 20th, 2017, 3:58 pm 
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I agree. PJ has the talent of ruining even the most beautifully beginning scenes to something nah-nah-crappy. But I like that Galadriel at least is portrayed well by the script and by Cate.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: April 7th, 2017, 1:02 am 
Gondorian
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The relationship and bond between Gandalf and Galadriel is, I think, mostly due to the fact that they are both ringbearers. There is a special thing that Ringbearers​ do where they can sense each other's thoughts and make conversation without speech. In the book we see this in Grey Havens when the 3 elf ringbearers are together and they sit under the stars talking telepathically and its really cool. In the movies it kind of shows it as well. Galadriel speaks into the minds of each member of the fellowship, but 2-way conversation only happens between ringbearers like with Frodo in the mirror of Galadriel scene. So that was the deal with the white council scene, in case anyone didn't know that.

There is also the fact mentioned earlier that they probably knew each other in Valinor. That would be fun to write fanfic about ;-)

They were also two very wise people in the midst of one of the hardest ages in the history of ME. There had to be a special bond between them since they we're basically trying to solve the world's problems together.

Hanasian, another thing to add to the very short list of good things about this movie is the music! Best part of any movie in my opinion and this was no exception. Also smaug was very pretty,and Benedict did an awesome job with the voice. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: April 7th, 2017, 12:12 pm 
Istari
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I have vague memories of having at least started a comment here. I have clearer memories that it was quite likely a rant (though PJ would not be entirely to blame here, I have the feeling that some people have just read too many schmaltzy love stories. :yuck:

If I started, for some reason I decided not to post. Probably too much of a rant ...

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: April 7th, 2017, 5:43 pm 
Gondorian
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I'm not so sure Galadriel knew the Maia Olorin in the West, at least not necessarily in a significant way that is; and in the context of the First Age, given one possible history of the Elessar stone anyway. In her youth Nerwende Artanis was proud, selfwilled, and had dreams of lands and dominions that might be her own "to order as she would without tutelage". And the Maia who dwelt in Lorien often sought the house of Nienna, where he learned pity and patience.

And from my interpretation of the [admittedly brief] description in Valaquenta, Olorin often walked among the Elves unseen, or in form as one of them [another way of hiding among them in my opinion] "and they did not know whence came the fair visions or promptings of wisdom that he put into their hearts."

Of course, who can say for certain!

And granted, absence of evidence is obviously not the best argument, but to note some positive evidence anyway: Tolkien gives the young Galadriel a notable relationship with Melian -- at least after rebelling and crossing into Middle-earth -- and notes a friendship in Aman between the reincarnated Glorfindel and Olorin.


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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: April 8th, 2018, 3:39 pm 
Gondorian
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Also, idk if anyone mentioned this, but Galadriel is married y'all.

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: April 9th, 2018, 10:51 am 
Istari
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No question, people looking for something like romantic involvement are certainly not dissuaded from such assumptions by the way the White Council was handled by PJ. As has been mentioned before, he has a rare talent for getting things seriously wrong compared to canon, however defined. PJ simply made the most gigantic fanfic of JRRT around, excessively so in TH.

Beyond this, as has also been commented, nod to the drearier and dumber conventions of Hollywood (some things appear to be a must-have even if they stick out in a given film like an inflamed thumb, an idiotic anachronism), PJ has turned a more overriding aspect of the relationship between Gandalf and Galadriel totally on its head. As a Maia, Gandalf’s native power was immensely greater than that of the greatest Elf – which would mean Galadriel and Fëanor (in that order) originally, later Glorfindel due to his reincarnation and return to Middle-earth, a foreshadowing (again on a decidedly lower level) of Gandalf returning as The White. How the limitations placed on the Istari in their activities in Middle-earth by the Valar brought Saruman and Gandalf “within range” of the powers of the greatest Elves of the Third Age (“young” Elrond and Galadriel as Ring-bearers, plus again the singular Glorfindel) is unclear. Without any doubt, Gandalf the White only has one peer in Middle-earth – Sauron.

In the Dol Guldur part, it is Galadriel who single-handedly (was she holding the phial she gave Frodo in LoTR in her hand while giving Sauron the “not-amused” treatment?) drop-kicks Sauron back east. Yes, those present at this confrontation in Dol Guldur are the “White Council” of the film, Gandalf, Galadriel, Saruman and Elrond. OK, one does have to keep an eye on the costs of employing actors, but the “actual” White Council had several more members. Celeborn, Glorfindel and Cirdan without a doubt, probably some other unnamed high Noldor from Imladris (some of Cirdan’s lieutenants too?), possibly Thranduil. The whole point in the writing was that the White Council had to confront Sauron as a whole (and JRRT keeps such messy details as troops and stuff pointedly unclear). And of course Sauron had to a degree anticipated such an action, and had prepared his retreat to Barad-dûr. And never mind that the Nazgûl had captured Minas Anor, thereafter called Minas Morgul, in 2002 TA, over 900 years before Bilbo’s adventure, and had not been “entombed” in any silly way. My personal guess about the Galadriel “not amused” against Sauron scene is that PJ liked the special effects in Fellowship when Frodo offers the One Ring to Galadriel, which gave Cate Blanchett a scary effect weakly echoing the description of the scene in the book before she rejects the One Ring. PJ loves people in a “monster mode”, or something to the effect (Marvel’s dear old Hulk suddenly pops into mind unbidden … :lol: )

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 Post subject: Re: Gandalf and Galadriel
PostPosted: June 2nd, 2018, 1:41 pm 
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Well, speaking absolutely movie-wise, I felt that spark, too. But I felt it in a way, that there was nothing physical between them, ever. Instead, Galadriel might have felt more understood by Gandalf than she could ever feel by anyone, Celeborn included. And that they might feel something little romantic towards each other, but they would never act on it.
In my opinion, it was nice to make it a bit confusing in the movie. Since real life relationships are also not just black and white.


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