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Post subject: Arwen Undomiel or Arwen Evenstar Posted: June 4th, 2005, 1:17 pm |
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Joined: 03 June 2005 Posts: 13144 Location: Heaven: Rockin' with Severus Snape Country:
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Okay.........I've read LotR like a million times but I still don't understand this one thing. Why is Arwen called two different things? (Arwen Undomiel and Arwen Evenstar) Do they mean different things? Or the same thing in Elven or something.........can someone please help me with this?
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Post subject: Posted: June 4th, 2005, 1:19 pm |
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Joined: 04 June 2005 Posts: 869 Location: No clue.
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Undomiel is Elvish for Evenstar. So people call Arwen, Arwen Undomiel, or Arwen Evenstar. It's the same thing
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Post subject: Posted: June 4th, 2005, 1:30 pm |
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Joined: 04 June 2005 Posts: 12592
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Yes, Undómiel translates Evenstar and is a title given to Arwen because of her beauty. "She is the Evening Star of her people".
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Post subject: Posted: June 4th, 2005, 1:33 pm |
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Joined: 04 June 2005 Posts: 869 Location: No clue.
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Yesh, exactly. Hope we could be of some help to you.
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Post subject: Posted: June 4th, 2005, 1:47 pm |
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Joined: 04 June 2005 Posts: 2671 Location: the Netherlands
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Yay, my mother asked me the same question and I gave her the same answer. So I was right. *looks around and feels good*
Arwen Undomiel, I love that name...
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Post subject: Posted: June 4th, 2005, 2:16 pm |
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Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 4717 Location: Middle-earth Country:
Gender: Female
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Yupses. Unfortunately a lot of people think it's her last name, just like people say Legolas' last name is Greenleaf. Also, a lot of people forget that Evenstar is short for Evening Star, so they pronounce it Eh-vehn-star instead of Ee-vehn-star.
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Post subject: Posted: June 4th, 2005, 2:21 pm |
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Joined: 06 May 2005 Posts: 15181 Location: Minas Morgul
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Legolas = Leafgreen
Leafgreen Greenleaf...
How funny ^.^
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Post subject: Posted: June 5th, 2005, 12:11 am |
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Joined: 04 June 2005 Posts: 1388 Location: California
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Yup! As everyone has explained; Undomiel is the elvish translation of Evenstar. She is the Evening Star because of her dark beauty.
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Post subject: Posted: June 5th, 2005, 6:07 pm |
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Joined: 03 June 2005 Posts: 13144 Location: Heaven: Rockin' with Severus Snape Country:
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Thanks everyone that info was most helpful!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post subject: Posted: June 6th, 2005, 7:40 am |
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Joined: 05 June 2005 Posts: 127 Location: Lothlorien
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ahhh undomiel, the evenstar of her people. her foremother tinniviel was the morning star and was also known for her dark beauty and thus arwen who it was said walked in the image of her foemother, and her fate was alike sadly . and she was called the evenstar, last born of her people.
The morning star and the evening star both faced the same doom in many ways, it is sad really. that two of the fairest ever said to live should die because of their love of a mortal and be doomed to death and after to be sent to where mortals drift whn the long sleep takes them. aragorn first mistaked arwen for tinniviel calling to her "tinniviel, tinniviel" and she stopped and turned to him and spoke. "why do you call me by that name?" and aragorn responded "because if you are indeed not she then you walk in her likeness". ok im ranting lol i know alot about arwen,aragorn,tinniviel and galadriel lol.
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Post subject: Posted: June 6th, 2005, 2:02 pm |
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Joined: 03 June 2005 Posts: 13144 Location: Heaven: Rockin' with Severus Snape Country:
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Thanks Lady Alias!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post subject: Posted: June 7th, 2005, 2:39 am |
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Joined: 05 June 2005 Posts: 127 Location: Lothlorien
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lol no problem you picked a subject i know alot about lol
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Post subject: Posted: June 8th, 2005, 6:19 pm |
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Kitoky wrote: Legolas = Leafgreen
Leafgreen Greenleaf...
How funny ^.^
haha yeah that is
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Post subject: Posted: June 9th, 2005, 9:06 pm |
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Joined: 04 June 2005 Posts: 1388 Location: California
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Actually, Legolas means what his last name is. "greenleaf".
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Post subject: Posted: June 10th, 2005, 5:22 am |
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Joined: 04 June 2005 Posts: 12592
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Oh, this eternal subject on elven names...
Well, elves don't have last names in the sense we use it and I don't think that was what you meant either, Arien Elensar....
If anything they have 'titles' like Elrond Peredhil (which translates into Half-elven because of his blood-line), Arwen Undómiel (translates into Evening Star because of her beauty), Lúthien Tinúviel (translates into Nightingale because of her beautiful voice).
Legolas is called Greenleaf in the Common Tongue.... but now I think of I can't remember any good reason for that? Is there a reason why Tolkien writes Legolas Greenleaf while speaking of him? Why wouldn't he simply use Thranduilion (son of Thranduil)?
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Post subject: Posted: June 10th, 2005, 11:26 pm |
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Joined: 04 June 2005 Posts: 1388 Location: California
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Yeah, I had just written that as a quick post and didn't really pay attention to my wording. Sorry. Both titles were used for Legolas but by different people so maybe the way they speak is different. Well, Legolas is from what was once called Greenwood the Great so I can see why greenleaf would work and also it sort of goes with the atmosphere or his father and Mirkwood.
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