In the Movie version of FotR, Gandalf reveals the history of the ring and Frodo immediately departs for Rivendell. In the books, however, two or three weeks pass before the story picks up and Frodo cannot tear himself away from the shire. He was "reluctant to start...he wanted to savour as much as he could of his last summer in the Shire."

What do you make of the differences? Of course it'd be hard to pause in the middle of the movie, but do you think Tolkien made the right choice by having Frodo tarry, and if so, do you see anything about his character from this? Something that you might not have noticed from the movies?


I've also wondered what a frugal supper would be for hobbits. In Ch. 3 it says Merry, Frodo, and Sam at a frugal supper for hobbits. Knowing how much hobbits eat for their size, I imagine it would still be quite a bit. I don't believe that a hobbit would allow himself to stop eating until the full signal if he could help it.


There's also an interesting bit where Sam reveals that Black Riders have been seen in the Shire, the first hint of such happenings since Gandalf spoke of them in Bag End. Do you think the story would have been at all different if Sam had told Frodo of the presence of Black Riders in the Shire before setting out? Frodo says they could have been more careful...

What do you make of the Elves in this chapter?

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Starting October 13th: globe trotting from my kitchen. Follow along on Cook In Fifty-Two

Aiya:)! I agree with you. Frodo did tarry quite a while in the book before starting on his journey. I Think Tolkein was right to have Frodo tarry in the Shire for a long time. It shows the mindset of the character more ( his love for the Shire was very descriptive in the book). As for a hobbits' frugal meal. The only instance I can cite was in Bilbo's "breakfast" that he served the thirteen dwarves in "The Hobbit" ( feeding them seed-cakes tea, etc:) ). I do know the Hobbits' fondness for mushrooms. Frodo raided Farmer Maggot's farm many a time while growing up:). Merry, Pippin, sam, and Fatty Bolger seem to love them too ( they tried to "steal" some when Farmer Maggot gave a basket full of them before they left his house. As for the Black Riders, I think Frodo would not have went on his journey had Sam told him about them. Gandalf I think was more of the person to hint about them because I think Frodo trusts him as a wizard of his word:); moreover, Gandalf told him about the ring and how the Black Riders were "attached" to them ~ therefore Frodo knew he had to leave. If Sam told him, Frodo probably would tell Sam about the Ring and maybe hide it, and hide from the riders ~ knowing nothing about the connection between the Ring and them. Therefore I think, Frodo would stay in the Shire had Sam told him about it. I hope all of that makes sense:). Well, that's it!
Námarië, Tenn'enquetielva ar Nai cuilelya nauva mára!
Lady Nienna

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Well in the movie I don't think it would have worked to have Frodo stay in the Shire. PJ knew he only had so much time so he had to cut some things out. Also in the movie when Frodo and Sam leave Gandalf goes to see them off so if any Ring Wraiths had been at Sam's hobbit hole Gandalf would have told Frodo and probably wouldn't have left him untill they got to Bree. So in my mind the Ring Wraiths had't appeared to Frodo, Sam, or Gandlaf in the movie untill after Frodo and Sam were leaving.

As for the frugal supper who knows what that means. I believe it would probably seem like a lot to a human just because Hobbits eat so much but I'm not sure.

Edit: Oh man I'm such an idiot. I just remember that the ring wraiths had appeared in the movie before Frodo and Sam left. There goes most of my theory then I'll have to revise it. *Revised*

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"There's an ocean between.....where I am and where I want to be"

I think Tolkien and PJ both made the right choices. Tolkien's choice to have Frodo wait shows more of his hobbit nature and his love for the Shire. Also it shows that he's not sure he'll be coming back ever again ("Bilbo went to find a treasure, there and back again; but I go to lose one, and not to return, as far as I can see." Frodo to Gandalf on page 65 of my version) and show's his courage in going anyway. This works great in the book, but movies are different.

PJ had the enormous task of taking a 398 page book and turning it into a 2 and a half hour movie. Things had to go, and what better thing to cut then 17 years of nothing but waiting and wondering.

The frugal supper is an interesting tid bit and it's just one of the few little quirks of humor in the books that aren't always picked up the first read. That's what makes reading them over and over again so enjoyable.

One other interesting thing in this chapter tolkien personifies a fox. This is the only spot (that I'm aware of) that any animals are referred to as having thoughts (or at least in a personable way) in the books and it's interesting to speculate as to whether Tolkien meant for all the animals in Middle-earth to be able to reason and carry on "business" and maybe even talk. Here's the spot I'm taking about for those of you that are interested: "A fox passing through the wood on business of his own stopped several minutes and sniffed.
'Hobbits!' he though. 'Well, what next? I have heard of strange doings in this land, but seldom heard of a hobbit sleeping out of doors under a tree. Three of them! There's something mighty queer behind this.'"

I've always loved that little bit and wondered about what the fox's "business" might have been...RP idea anyone?

So there's my thought's!

~Merry

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Became a Rider of Rohan at 10:16am on 8/22/06
~Merry

That would be interesting twist on the entire LotR idea, all through the eyes of passing birds, bees, butterflies, foxes, rabbits (those poor "coneys" Sam stews later in the story ). I think you're right that it's the only time Tolkien uses an animal to comment on the story, and I wonder why he chose it. Sure is a great touch.

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Starting October 13th: globe trotting from my kitchen. Follow along on Cook In Fifty-Two

That would be really interesting. Except it'd be hard to do the whole books that way especially in the Dead Marshes where there weren't any animals "No crunchable birdses to eat!" except worms. lol.

Yeah that little paragraph just always sticks out for me when I read the books.

~Merry

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Became a Rider of Rohan at 10:16am on 8/22/06
~Merry

On Tolkien's part, I believe that having Frodo stay in the Shire for a while does show more of his character. While I give huge credit to the makers of FotR the movie, they made Frodo seem much younger and more eager for adventure than I think Tolkien envisioned. Frodo adored the Shire, and didn't want to leave at all. I didn't find that as evident in the film.

I really loved the bit about the Elves in Ch.3. Tho I may be a bit of a sucker for all things Elvish, I feel like Tolkien reveals a lot about his favourite race in this passage. In the movie, the Elves only made it into the EE, but even then, they were only viewed from a distance. I especially enjoyed how Frodo knows more about the Elves than the movie lets on.

The particular quote that I love is: "'And it is also said,' answered Frodo: 'Go not to the Elves for counsel, for they will say both yes and no.'
'Is it indeed?' laughed Gildor. 'Elves seldom give unguarded advice, for advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise, and all courses may run ill.'"

I don't know exactly why I love that part, perhaps because it is quite true, and good advice in itself.

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Thanks Haldir and Gil!
"You said: I know that this will hurt, but if I don't break your heart then things will just get worse..."

Yes! I forgot we meet Gildor in this chapter! (I haven't finnished it yet... ) I love our first look Elves and that they save Frodo and the hobbits from the wraith with their singing. And I love that Frodo know some Elvish. You never hear him speak it in the movies. I also love the part Luthien was talking about. It's good stuff all of it. We love Tolkien...

~Merry

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Became a Rider of Rohan at 10:16am on 8/22/06
~Merry

Yeah, after you read the book FOTR sucksss...
So many parts of the book- Buckland-old forest-Tom Bombadil and everything is showed so shortly! especialy the "just walking parts"...
After i read FOTR (it was after i saw the movies) I saw it on TV! It was so bad, I started to feel that the movies are bad . But now i can separate between them and i realy like the movies!

*The part with the trollshaws in the books (3 stone Trolls) is in the movie! the part when arwen comes to take Frodo away to Rivendell- if you look good you can see the trolls behind Aragorn.
** And you do hear Frodo speaks Elvish in ROTK when "fighting" Shelob.

That's he does! Thanks Willow.

About not liking the movie after reading that book, I'm glad I read the books first. That's all can say. lol

So anyone else got something to say about ch. 3?

~Merry

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Became a Rider of Rohan at 10:16am on 8/22/06
~Merry

You're right! There's yet ANOTHER character trait from the books which adds depth and was left out by PJ & Co. Sam's love of lore and now Frodo's knowledge of Elvish (except for when he calls out in Shelob's lair). Woah.

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Starting October 13th: globe trotting from my kitchen. Follow along on Cook In Fifty-Two

Frodo demonstrated his knowledge of Elvish briefly again when he helped get them into Moria. It also demonstrated a hobbits love of riddles (Like Bilbo)

The differences between book and movie have been picked over a lot. While The movie Fellowship needfully had to gloss over details and modify character traits for the sake of momentum, it usually allowed those traits to show up in other ways.

For example, They didn't have Glorfindel driving the Nazgul into the river, but Aragorn did use fire to drive them back at Weathertop.

Frodo was younger in the film as depicted, but he was also a younger hobbit in the books, and when he would have received the Ring (age 33) at Bilbo's farewell party, he would have effectively stopped aging at that point anyway.

The books are able to give many pages of extra backstory that cannot be effectively summed up, even in a short scene. Rather than do a hack job on some of these things, Peter Jackson chose to omit them, and make a better film. As he said many times in interviews, he wanted the best film possible that preserved the key elements of the books, not every detail.

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I think it fits to Frodo, that he didn't want to leave at first, but I think it would have been difficult to make him stay, it would have been a bit weird.. I think that Frodo and Sam would have been more careful if they had known about the black rider, but maybe they would have been so frightened that they wouldn't have had the courage to leave perhaps. I really loved the elves in chapter three and I found it sad that they weren't in the movies.

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Can someone tell me why pippen is traveling with Frodo and Sam? I think I not sure I am right if Pippen is going with Frodo to the house in Buckland and is going with him on the quest with the ring. Then when would they met Merry?

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They meet Merry in Buckland at the ferry and he travels to Frodo's house. He and fatty decorated then house for Frodo and Pippin and Sam helped him carry his baggage.

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I agree with Meriadoc-Tolkien and PJ made the right choices about when Frodo left the Shire.
With Frodo waiting to leave, it shows the careful, reluctant side of him. He's lived in the Shire his entire life, and then to find suddenly that he has to leave to save a world he knows little about, it's understandable he wants to stay in the Shire as long as possible.
On the other hand, if PJ had put Frodo buying a house, selling Bag End, the walking to Crickhollow, it would have stretched out the movie, and possibly lost some people's interest.

I like those little interesting, amusing bits scattered throughout the book, like about the hobbits having a frugal supper.

Maybe if Sam had told Frodo about the Black Riders before they left, they might have cut across country from the start. Maybe that would have been better, it could have kept them from being seen, but it also could have slowed them down.

I like the part with the Elves. For some reason, I liked the short descriptions of the bread and drink. It's also the 1st time the readers "meet" the Elves, so it's sort of a first impression-the readers get to start forming their own feelings towards the Elves.