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Why the Nazgûl fear water?
https://arwen-undomiel.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=17419		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Elenthari [ January 4th, 2008, 9:48 am ]
Post subject:  Why the Nazgûl fear water?
I'm sorry if we have thread about this already. :blush:

I know that Tolkien never was able to explain why the Ringwraiths have fear from water.
But these days I started wondering what the answer could be.
Of course I associated the water with Ulmo and my first thought was that maybe the Nazgûl somehow feel his presence.
My other idea was the symbolic meaning of the water as a source of life,which is the opposite of the 'state' of the Ringwraiths.

Any other opinions?
Author:  Eä [ January 4th, 2008, 10:22 am ]
Post subject: 
The first image that comes to mind when I think of water and Ringwraiths is the scene on the border of Rivendell where the Nazgûl is washed away with the river Bruinen. In that case the Nazgûl were overthrown by Elrond's powers as lord of Rivendell and possibly also by the power of nature that was called upon to defend the place from the Shadow.

If the Ringwraiths have a general fear of water (I haven't really heard of it :-)) it might be because they are.. well, wraiths... they don't have a body or substance so they are quite exposed to weather and elements, like fire and water.
Author:  Fíriel_18190 [ January 5th, 2008, 5:54 am ]
Post subject: 
Eä wrote:
The first image that comes to mind when I think of water and Ringwraiths is the scene on the border of Rivendell where the Nazgûl is washed away with the river Bruinen. In that case the Nazgûl were overthrown by Elrond's powers as lord of Rivendell and possibly also by the power of nature that was called upon to defend the place from the Shadow.

Yeah I definitely agree with that.
If they were scared of water in general (not sure about it..) then I'd agree with what Elenthari said. Those would also be the first things coming to my mind, because in the Sil it says that Ulmo always cared a lot about Middle-Earth, so I could imagine that it has something to do with him.
But also the interpretation of water as a source of life sounds reasonable to me.
Author:  Precious [ January 7th, 2008, 11:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
When I first watched FOTR, I thought it a bit strange that the wraiths just stopped dead before the river. I didn't quite understand that. Nowhere in the books do I remember wraiths being afraid of any element. Though, the conlusions you made were reasonable, and possibly true.
Author:  Eä [ January 8th, 2008, 4:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
Aragorn manages to fight off the wraiths with fire on Amon Sûl (A Knife in the Dark, FotR) and later on the river Bruinen rises against the Ringwraiths (The Flight to the Ford, FotR) by the powers of Elrond, Lord of Rivendell. :-)
Author:  Precious [ January 8th, 2008, 5:25 pm ]
Post subject: 
But does it say anywhere that they are necessarily afraid of that?
Author:  Elenthari [ January 9th, 2008, 10:01 am ]
Post subject: 
I think I read that in "The Unfinished Tales"...I'm not sure was it in the notes of Christopher Tolkien or in one of the letters of his father...:erm:
Author:  Fíriel_18190 [ January 9th, 2008, 2:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
^
yeah, now you're saying it.. I think I read it somewhere in the UT, too.. aaaargh how could I forget about it :blush:
Author:  Precious [ January 9th, 2008, 8:13 pm ]
Post subject: 
Yes... I'm not quite that far. I'm still reading The Book of Lost Tales Vol. 1, so I've a ways to go still! Thanks for the insight!
Author:  Fíriel_18190 [ January 10th, 2008, 6:11 am ]
Post subject: 
^
yeah well, I've never read the Book of Lost Tales so I don't think that we have heaps of more information than you do. In fact I've read none of the HoME series, but only LotR, the Sil, the Hobbit and the UT
Author:  goldelf [ January 11th, 2008, 1:40 am ]
Post subject: 
i dont remember reading anything about that in UT.i guess they have the fear of the elements(fire,water,light) maybe because they represent life and the Nazgul hate them cos they are ruined,undead mockeries of life.or something like that.
Author:  Precious [ January 11th, 2008, 3:18 pm ]
Post subject: 
Good point
Author:  Fíriel_18190 [ January 11th, 2008, 4:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
goldelf wrote:
i dont remember reading anything about that in UT.

I think it's in one of the comments by Christopher Tolkien, not in one of the stories themselves. Also, I'm not 100% sure if it was in the UT, but I believe it is.
Author:  Elenthari [ January 11th, 2008, 4:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
It's definitely not in "The Silmarillion".I have the book here and I searched for this note but I haven't found it.I haven't read HoME either (though I want to,but I can't find it here even in English :annoyed2:).So I think it was in UT.

I agree with what gold elf said-actually this was one of my opinions *points the 1st post*
Author:  mephiston, lord of death [ January 12th, 2008, 3:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
Im pretty sure that in the Sil that Morgoths servants (especially his orcs and other soldiers) feared the water, and made no attempt to attack via it, I suppose because they couldnt control it at all.
Another reason I think could b because of the downfall fo Numenor. Sauron, who was caught up in it may be scared of it, and since the Nazgul are tied to Sauron's life force and power, maybe they have his fears or whatnot.

But hey, thats my two pence.....
Author:  Precious [ January 12th, 2008, 9:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
That makes so much sense
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