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PostPosted: January 29th, 2008, 10:43 am 
Balrog
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hmm yeah and I don't actually see a special connection between Arwen and Sauron/the Ring that would make her weak but not the others. I mean, if she had been the keeper of one of the three rings that'd have been a different thing.

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 Post subject: Re: The Evenstar
PostPosted: June 9th, 2011, 7:33 pm 
Hobbit
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I didn't think that Arwen was becoming mortal. In the book that is. I don't remember her being given the choice by the Valar. And when she said that she made the same choice as Luthien, I think she ment that it was to wed a mortal. She did live longer than Aragorn. I think it says she went back to where Lothlorien was.

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 Post subject: Re: The Evenstar
PostPosted: June 9th, 2011, 9:50 pm 
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I'm a little confused to what you're saying, Timelord. In the books Arwen definitely was given the choice of Luthien, and chose to die a mortal death. I don't think it's quite as clear-cut as 'she became mortal' unless you're distinguishing 'mortal' from 'human.' She definitely didn't become human. She did die a mortal death though, and left the circles of the world like men do.

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 Post subject: Re: The Evenstar
PostPosted: June 12th, 2011, 1:19 am 
Hobbit
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I guess I must have missed that part. Could you tell me where it says that, I would like to read it again. It has been awhile since I read them.

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 Post subject: Re: The Evenstar
PostPosted: August 9th, 2011, 1:02 pm 
Rider of Rohan
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I like that PJ made the jewel, or the Evenstar, more predominant in the movie. It was kinda like a constant reminder. A sweet one. :D

But, he did seem to take some things too far. :confused2: like the whole, "The light of the Evenstar wanes, Arwen is dying" thing. Dumb, since it isn't true. It also contradicts what Arwen said earlier in the movies; she said the Evenstar would not wax or wane, like her love. It does make her seem weak. >:(

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 Post subject: Re: The Evenstar
PostPosted: August 21st, 2011, 5:58 pm 
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^PJ is a romantic.. or he knows his audience is. :P

Timelord wrote:
I didn't think that Arwen was becoming mortal. In the book that is. I don't remember her being given the choice by the Valar. And when she said that she made the same choice as Luthien, I think she ment that it was to wed a mortal. She did live longer than Aragorn. I think it says she went back to where Lothlorien was.

Arwen makes the choice of Lúthien.. it's in the Appendix:
She says:
Quote:
"I will cleave to you, Dúnadan, and turn from the Twilight"

And later after the war is ended:
Quote:
"But Arwen became as a mortal woman and yet it was not her lot to die until all that she had gained was lost.

And when Aragorn is dying and asks her to leave for Valinor, she replies:
Quote:
"Nay, dear lord, that choice is long over. There is now no ship that will bear me hence, and I must indeed abide the Doom of Men, whether I will or I nill: the loss and the silence."


Tragically beautiful actually. :)

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 Post subject: Re: The Evenstar
PostPosted: July 5th, 2016, 9:45 pm 
Dunedain Ranger of Arnor
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Quote:
…But the Queen Arwen said: 'A gift I will give you. For I am the daughter of Elrond. I shall not go with him now when he departs to the Havens; for mine is the choice of Lúthien, and as she so have I chosen, both the sweet and the bitter. But in my stead you shall go, Ring-bearer, when the time comes, and if you then desire it. If your hurts grieve you still and the memory of your burden is heavy, then you may pass into the West, until all your wounds and weariness are healed. But wear this now in memory of Elfstone and Evenstar with whom your life has been woven!'
And she took a white gem like a star that lay upon her breast hanging upon a silver chain, and she set the chain about Frodo's neck. 'When the memory of the fear and the darkness troubles you,' she said, 'this will bring you aid.'…


I don't think the jewel had anything to do with Arwen's mortality, nor was it a ticket to Valinor. It was simply a symbol that would lift Frodo's spirit when he suffered from PTSD by turning his thoughts to Elfstone and Evenstar.

Timelord wrote:
I didn't think that Arwen was becoming mortal. In the book that is. I don't remember her being given the choice by the Valar. And when she said that she made the same choice as Luthien, I think she ment that it was to wed a mortal. She did live longer than Aragorn. I think it says she went back to where Lothlorien was.


Yes, I believe Arwen did in fact become 'mortal' with her choice of Luthien to marry the Mortal Aragorn. Having already lived 2739 years when Aragorn and Arwen plighted their troth (became engaged), she was unique as a mortal. At what time she indeed became mortal is open for debate, but I believe that point was when they were actually married. She would have been well into her 2800's, maybe even pushing 2900 when Aragorn lay down and his spirit departed. At this point the bitter pill of mortality took hold of her, and though she had her son (and some daughters?) with her, she soon lost the will to live without Aragorn, and went off to Lorien where she herself lay down and her spirit passed.

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